With ArcheAge now launched, some players are questioning Trion Worlds monetization system. Zach Sharpes discusses this system in depth, and concludes whether or not it’s Pay to Win.‏




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  1. The sage on March 17, 2015

    Number 1 of the Pay to cheat games. To write this cost me 5 labor. You will understand

  2. No Name on October 3, 2014

    The price for APEX on the auction house has increase, its usually around 38 gold to 40 gold but now it’s like 100 gold per APEX. And I’m talking about the Buy price. As for the bidding price, you really need to have a lot of gold to play, maybe twice or even more times of 100 gold just to be on the safe side to challenging other bidders.

  3. Varol on October 2, 2014

    This is a joke right? The problem is that even if you pay you cant do shit in this game. I usually make a buy from every game i try (maybe i’m old school but i really think people should make some money from their work) but is first time i regret to buy subscription (patron).
    So I paid for patrons tatus hoping to experience the system of building your house and guess what: I struggled for three days to build the house and I dont fucking find a damn single spot free. Even in pvp areas is full.
    Anyway who labeled this game as SandBox is the bigest idiot who was part of this industry.
    We had more chances environmental change in Lieange than archeage. You can mine better in damn WoW . So yes you can pay to win, to win a lot of nerve damaged.
    Learn what sandbox meens damn idiot. Try Wurm and after that start to name you games as SandBox MMORPG.

  4. Smoke on October 1, 2014

    Game is not pay to win. People who say it is are fucking retarded. People cry and whine 24/7 now if things aren’t given to them for free.

    Archeage isn’t the best game, but at least it offers something different than most mmo at the moment.

    • Bone on February 9, 2015

      Some people play hard and have a good set but using money will be much better set.
      go to pvp and you can see the difference in the free and P2W that apart from being patron buy materials to be set or buy things. that free will take a long time.

      But it all depends on how you play. if you play sometimes not expect to be the best in pvp and have the best set just enjoy the game.

      PS: is full of bot, take land, farm materials.

      stop playing for many bot to take ground. I was patron using game gold but the real money they spend more stronger

  5. Apoth on September 30, 2014

    No one has even mentioned that you need a special real money purchased certificate to even post items on the auction house, which I think is one of the core features of an mmorpg. With that said, the pvp is what let me down.

    I didn’t really care about crafting or dungeons, screw the labor points I get gold from quests (until they actually ran out and it went to boring daily quests for half the reward). Not to mention some quests require hours upon hours of grinding or a quick 10-20 gold purchase in the aunction house to complete it for a measily 2 gold reward.

    I tried the arena once, and only once. My opponent did nothing but stealth, run, dot, run, dot, run, dot, run, etc. It was in fact impossible for my current skills to catch him which means….. ding ding ding spend 1-3 gold resetting your points (oh and then you have to level up new ones for days again). Just one match frustrated me enough to look at this game as a whole and realize what crap it is.

    Next we go onto open world pvp. Well first of all you get nothing if you aren’t at war. If you are at war, you still don’t get anything except sometimes 20 honor points if you manage to kill someone. Mostly it is just… pointless. There are guilds who pointlessly gank lowbies.

    So I thought I’d set out at sea and look for some hidden islands to steal stuff from (after all that’s what I heard you can do in this game). I found an island. Everything is immune. Can’t steal anything, can’t destroy anything…. maybe I can kill this unsuspecting guy farming….. I sneak up to him and WHAM BANG WHAM nothing…. wtf his health isn’t going down? About 15 seconds later (literally… and that’s a long time in pvp) the guy comes back from his afk and manages to kill me for free while he remained invincible. I thought…. ok maybe a weird buff or bug or something. I try another island…. same thing. Ok this sucks.

    Another frustration was when I finally got my clipper boat… well it just manages to always get destroyed everytime I take it out. Once by ambushed pvpers and once by these npc pirates that one shot you (which I thought was totally low down and dirty). It costs quite a few gold to get a repair sandglass.

    Overall this game is just too limiting on your actions. It feels like America, you think you are free but you are not.

    • Mike Petes on October 1, 2014

      LooooL…. it seems that even people who like to pvp start to realize that open – world pvp is wrong and ruin the games Imagine how many people DON’T play Archeage because of the forced-pvp crap. Imagine if you had those people in game to do raids and dungeons with.

  6. Nonya on September 29, 2014

    Who cares, this game is just another generic MMO anyway, nothing in this game is new, from making and owning boats, to gliders, to farms and housing, there is nothing in this game that u can point at that is original, even the lame jury system isnt anything new to games.

    • Macguffinstv on September 29, 2014

      Your comment makes 0 sense. You tell me what they can put in the game that is original. NOTHING.

      There is no such thing as original anymore, sorry to break it to you. It’s just like writing a book, there is nothing you can write that isn’t inspired by or just like something else.

      TL:DR – There is no such thing as Original Concepts anymore. Everything has been done before and games can only build on those same things and try to make them better than before.

      • Mike Petes on October 1, 2014

        Ok, then answer this: Whats the point of hobbies, crafting, building and more activities when you can’t enjoy them because some complex-from-school-when-beaten guy attacks you while you’r fishing? I don’t understand why forced-pvp game even have activities other than moba style fighting…

  7. Mewtwo on September 29, 2014

    Yep…

    If I wanted a game with this kind of “labor point system,” I might as well play a browser game where points are given free at the same rate for everyone and offline gains as well! Man this labor point system is just horrible…

  8. Acilikola on September 29, 2014

    This game is nearly at the heart of worst-f2p model ever, close behind that of SWTOR with their inhumanly insane limitations on F2P users. As Cloak already mentioned, in order to use APEX system to be a premium user, you have to slave your life. By the time you have it, your character will not be yours anymore, it will be exactly identical to a gold farmers since basically you both have the same goal. And after the first purchase, you rinse and repeat each and every month for it.

    If you really want to give Trion a chance, I suggest Rift. It is nearly completely free (the major handicap between f2p and premium users is the ability to post auctions), and also it has the aforementioned REX system in it. Now I must admit, the platinums to get a REX is not going to be easy but for just 1 REX, you can have enough credits to get some really useful permanent account unlocks as well as ability to post auctions. To be honest though, I got my REX pretty late (after I got money from dailies, did not grind for it one bit) which did not really affect my gaming at all. I stashed all valuable things in bank until then. And with the new patch in October 8, the new expansion will be truly free to everyone again.

    I hope you give Rift a try, it can restore your faith in Trion to eventually make even this pile of shit right ^^

  9. Zyx on September 29, 2014

    I enjoyed the game up until you get permanently ganked at level 30 by griefer guilds, yes there’s even one called that.

    Besides that the pve is dull in the beginning but then picks up once you move into the bigger areas. I understand why this system of labour points is implemented so it doesn’t bother me. I just enjoy it for what it is.

  10. Thise on September 29, 2014

    Can you buy advantage? Yes? Then the game is pay to win.
    This game is pay to win but even if it was not it would still be a complete garbage. the game is a joke

  11. Player 1 on September 29, 2014

    Everything in Trion is p2w, it’s my second time i got frustrated in a game i really wanted, first was black gold then archeage, now i’m looking forward to Black Desert.

    • Phanda on September 30, 2014

      Not all games, i played Trove and its not p2w

      • Aaron on February 27, 2015

        This is slowly becoming. The free side is becoming more tedious for all.

  12. hovsep on September 29, 2014

    also crafting is even WORSE since it costs TONS of labor to craft a single item

    • hovsep on September 29, 2014

      yes black desert online has this sort of system too but you can upgrade it and everything costs 1 points

      also black desert online is not freaking focused on crafting and building

  13. Grossmond on September 29, 2014

    Trying to defend it from being “Pay-to-Win” is a loaded setup, the term itself means you can gain something only with money to gain an unfair advantage in either the PvE or PvP element of a game over free players. Which one can see is not the case from the first 2 minutes of this video.

    However this game is “Pay-to-Enjoy”, because a free player has to wait twice as long to do anything with Labor Points which is over HALF the game, and work ten times as harder to get the gold to get the APEX system to get you Patron status. Doing all that gathering and crafting costs Labor Points which you already generate at half the rate of a patron and NOT offline at all.

    Most people who get in on the APEX system for this will either spend the majority of their Labor Points on getting the gold to get more APEX before their 30 days ends, or will have inconsistent Patron status because they choose to enjoy more of those 30 days.

    It’s understandable that they have to make $$ some how, but this is one hell of a restrictive system for free players. The free players who play the game trying to enjoy the Sandbox portion of the game will be the portion of the player base that burns out and quits the fastest.

    • Cloak on September 29, 2014

      Doesn’t matter if its P2W/F2P. The game still sucks. By the time you get where you want to be you will have wasted so much time farming, you will be sick of the game by then. This game sucks and there is nothing that can change that because the farming is to inconvenient and labor points are annoying. I think whoever is trying to enjoy the sand boxing asspect of this game is better off playing Minecraft.

      • WarrfameVet on September 29, 2014

        Then explain to me why Warframe veterans are still out there grinding for hours?

        • Phanda on September 30, 2014

          Warframe is almost free game onething that you need to buy are slots

        • Zombie on September 30, 2014

          I question that every time I see a friend playing it on steam… Game is such grind its crazy. But… it does have interesting and fun gameplay to some people.

          Honestly… most successful franchises out there are pure, repetitive grinding… League of Legends, Call of Duty games, Pokemon games, DayZ, etc. If you look at their core leveling and progression… They are pure grind.

          Some people just don’t notice grind if they really enjoy the gameplay.

        • Payback on September 30, 2014

          Because they’re not the usual casual crowd.

  14. John Wayne on September 29, 2014

    Oh no Spunkify got fired, well finally i guess.

    • Spunkify on September 29, 2014

      Nope I am still here! Sorry to disappoint.

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